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Post by ES_97Sport on Jan 7, 2015 13:46:11 GMT -5
Keep in mind this is NOT just about getting them to fit. You have to find something that comes from a vehicle that matches your vehicle overall weight as well as the weight distribution front and rear.
My original Napa front coils for a 1/2 ton Ford PU 'fit' perfectly but the spring rate was really out of whack. They were designed for something with a lot more weight on the front than a Sport and that caused all kinds of problems - some of which I didn't even know I had until I got springs that were properly matched to the vehicle. This isn't off road specific - my big Sport handles, steers and rides better on the highway better than it ever did with the old springs.
If you dump whatever fits in, unless you're incredibly lucky, you'll be redoing it in pretty short order.
That's useful information on the body lift. I'm still on the fence in regards to replacing my big Sport with a LC and getting away from Mitsu for expedition driving. If I build another Sport, even if I don't do a 3-link and stick with radius arms, I'd like to keep the suspension down a couple inches and pull the body up instead. I REALLY don't need 25" under the frame. Back to the original 23" would be fine and the body lift would give me a little more clearance between the skids and rocker panels and a lot more clearance in the wheel wells for maybe a p-metric 36" or 37".
Look forward to a write up and lots of pictures.
Edward
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Post by redraif on Jan 9, 2015 14:55:00 GMT -5
I cranked my torsion bars down about 3/4 of the way, put a 2in body lift and 1in 1/2 wheel adaptors and I fit 285 75 16 with minimal scrub. Good to know. Where did you experience your scrubbing? When you say wheel adapters, are you refering to spacers to push out the factory rims by 1.5?
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Post by redraif on Jan 9, 2015 15:05:46 GMT -5
My original Napa front coils for a 1/2 ton Ford PU 'fit' perfectly but the spring rate was really out of whack. They were designed for something with a lot more weight on the front than a Sport and that caused all kinds of problems. So you replaced the actual coils with Ford coils. I was strictly going to look at spacers only. Would I still have to be concerned? I would think rubber is rubber that it would be diameter and thickness that were the concern? the right diameter to mate with the spring mount and coil... the right thickness to space out the coil for the right lift? Please correct me if I'm wrong... i will do my best to not diappoint!
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Post by ES_97Sport on Jan 9, 2015 18:06:14 GMT -5
... So you replaced the actual coils with Ford coils. I was strictly going to look at spacers only. Would I still have to be concerned? I would think rubber is rubber that it would be diameter and thickness that were the concern? the right diameter to mate with the spring mount and coil... the right thickness to space out the coil for the right lift? .... Sorry, I should have been clearer. I replaced the front coils on my big Sport that has the SAS in the front. I run a '75 Ford Bronco suspension and drive train in my big Sport. The front uses coils and radius arms on a Dana 44 solid axle. The rear is custom leafs from Alcan and another Dana 44. If you're looking at spacers - coil spacers that fit between the frame and coil or coil and axle - they need to be the correct height and fit. That pretty much covers it. The big problem with spacers that fit in the coils is coil bind, and stress from uneven compression. Spacers that fit between the chassis and spring or drive train and spring don't suffer from those problems. Coil bind is the worst and it will cause catastrophic sudden failure. Not only of the spring, but mounts, brackets, etc. The latter takes time and can result in the same thing but usually its massively accelerated spring wear. Spring spacers on top of or under the spring follow the same rules as blocks with leaf springs. Provided they are correctly sized and installed, don't stack them - EVER - and there is a realistic, safe maximum height. I don't see you having to worry about either of those. There is one thing that some coil setups have issues with that leafs don't. On some setups - like my 'Bird - the coils are compressed and decompression is the only thing holding them in place. My big Sport - and all Ford radius arm suspensions - have a little 'clip' that holds the spring in the bucket. If that clip is broken or removed and the suspension decompresses the spring will just fall out. Under normal driving conditions on a street driven vehicle with the rear sway bar attached, I don't think its possible to drop the rear axle far enough for the spring to come out. The sway bar limits travel quite a bit. So, you shouldn't have any worries. On an off road vehicle, yes, the assembly needs attention unless limiting straps are used to keep the suspension from 'over' flexing. I use limiting straps on the front in part to prevent this from happening. (that little clip isn't anything you'd want to rely on) So, yes you're correct. As long as they fit correctly, you should be good. BTW, they make both poly and rubber spacers. I think the only points between them are longevity and sound/vibration isolation ability. The rubber ones won't last as long but do a better job isolating the body from the axle. Reverse that for the poly ones. There's a BIG difference in sound/vibration isolation between rubber and poly body mounts, but in this case I think the difference would be negligible. I'd probably shoot for longer lasting poly if I had a choice. I don't know if you realize this, but you will need to install longer bump stops for the rear, too. You add 2" of height but you still have the same length spring with the same amount of compression and the same amount of upward travel. You will need to compensate by adding length to the bump stop so you don't end up with coil bind if you hit a pothole or speed bump. DO NOT neglect to do this. If you smack a speed bump @ 10 mph and you're metal on metal, you'll bust the crap out of something(s). Good way to snap an axle shaft, spring, spring mount, crack the frame, body mount, etc. Edward
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Post by redraif on Jan 11, 2015 20:16:36 GMT -5
Awesome info Edward. Thank you! I will be sure and check all this prior to doing anything to my suspension. In the mean time.... before the body lift... here is the rig with the 2 inch body lift.
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Post by ES_97Sport on Jan 12, 2015 18:03:20 GMT -5
Awesome info Edward. Thank you! I will be sure and check all this prior to doing anything to my suspension. No worries. Just don't forget the bump stops. Wow. That is really noticeable. Not used to seeing that much frame. Now you need tires and a set of skids. Edward
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Post by redraif on Jan 13, 2015 9:05:41 GMT -5
I can't wait to get the tires on... there are a lot of Montero Sports floating around.... on our daily commute we see at least 2 a day. But zero are in any way modified. They are all 100% stock. So just that makes me even more excited to get this rig looking tougher.
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Post by ES_97Sport on Jan 13, 2015 18:12:35 GMT -5
I can't wait to get the tires on... there are a lot of Montero Sports floating around.... on our daily commute we see at least 2 a day. But zero are in any way modified. They are all 100% stock. So just that makes me even more excited to get this rig looking tougher. Yep, see a couple a day or so, but they're all stock, too. I think my big Sport, my little '97 and Eric's big '98 Sport are the only three modified in CO. There may be one other black '98/99 but I can never tell if its a Sport or not when I see it. Edward
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Post by redraif on Jan 26, 2015 9:19:57 GMT -5
OK... fingers crossed. My tire guy has my set in hand. He is planning to deliver them to the house tonight. I will load them up in the Monty and drop the whole thing off at the shop for installation tomorrow. Happy dance!!!! I'm going with the Mickey Thompson ATZ P3 in the 285/75 r16s. Should be good for the mostly hwy travel this beast will see, but have the ability to handle the occational tame off road.
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Post by redraif on Jan 26, 2015 23:27:56 GMT -5
Got the tires! To the shop tomorrow!!!!
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Post by redraif on Feb 2, 2015 10:33:01 GMT -5
before the body lift... here is the rig with the 2 inch body lift. And here we are with the new tires. Better pics to come soon! The shop felt bad that they are still tinkering with the trans and I can't see my new tires on the rig, so the girl at the front desk sent these:
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Post by ES_97Sport on Feb 3, 2015 18:24:12 GMT -5
You popped the bottom off the fan cowl? Keep an eye on engine temps this summer.
Edward
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Post by redraif on Feb 4, 2015 10:27:51 GMT -5
I removed the 3 inch strip from the bottom of the fan shroud that is designed to detach. Will that effect things that drastically? I will keep an eye on it Edward.
If I ever get the truck long enough to tinker with it... LOL! I had planned to look into adjusting the height of the radiator itself to keep things cenetered up. I just went for quick and dirty to get the tires on.
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Post by redraif on Feb 4, 2015 21:55:13 GMT -5
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Post by ES_97Sport on Feb 5, 2015 15:55:39 GMT -5
I removed the 3 inch strip from the bottom of the fan shroud that is designed to detach. Will that effect things that drastically? I will keep an eye on it Edward. Mmmmm. I don't THINK so, but moving the fan down that far does create quite a gap and adding the load of bigger tires ... it's possible if the ambient temps are high enough. I wouldn't be surprised if you had issues while towing if the outside temps were up in the 90s+. I might suggest hooking up an OBD scanner and keeping an eye on the ECT here when temps start climbing this spring. If you start pushing 208/210 or higher regularly it would be time to address the cooling. Normally temps should hang in the mid-190s to low 200s, briefly peaking at 208/210. Constantly at 208/210+ is a problem. Sure. No issues there. One step at a time. There's no reason to jump the gun and try and fix a problem that may or may not even exist. As for relocating the radiator - Uh, no, you don't want to go there. There's a lot of stuff on that radiator support. Trying to move it is going to create a huge PITA and its going to hork up your air flow. Remember while you may move the radiator, the hole through the radiator support for air flow doesn't move. If you shove the radiator down 2", you're going to cut off 2" of radiator from getting any air flow through. You'd be significantly decreasing the surface area through which air flow. Bad, bad plan. This would be a REALLY good reason for a conversion to the Ford Contour dual cooling fan setup and would be a lot less of a headache. The Contour fans cooled my big Sport w/ the 3.0L fine with the stock radiator out in Moab so you won't have any issues there. You might want to consider it anyway down the road. They do free up a little bit of power sucked by the mechanical fan so they'd off-set your bigger tires a little. Edward
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