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Post by Naeos_Valkarian on Jan 7, 2020 23:53:58 GMT -5
I changed the oil in my sport a few days ago and found some metal shavings in the drain pan. This surprises me because there is no decrease in power (better than it's ever been honestly), no abnormal noises, and no other unusual symptoms of any kind. Is it possible this came from some other source or should I prepare for the worst? The largest shaving was measured at 1.45mm x .67mm and is ferrous as it stuck to a magnet.  |
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Post by 2003LimitedAWD on Jan 9, 2020 21:30:36 GMT -5
Hate to hear about that. Never a good sign to see metal shavings  I'm guessing that a main bearing (or more) is disintegrating and you'll likely start seeing/hearing symptoms soon. |
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Post by Naeos_Valkarian on Jan 10, 2020 0:21:49 GMT -5
Yeah, this really blows. I love my sport but it's my fault for riding it so hard all the time, I'm not going to pretend it's not at least 50% my fault lol. I change oil every 4500ish miles or so with 10w-30 pennzoil high mileage full synthetic as well as that engine restore additive which I thought was really awesome and I do honestly believe my cylinder compression got way better after using it.
I am planning on doing an engine rebuild, hopefully before it goes nuclear but in the end money, time, and a place to do the work are all issues. Either way I'm not getting rid of it, if I have to it'll sit till I can afford to rebuild it and I'll just buy another one for the mean time.
Edit:
If anyone knows a reputable place I can buy a reman short block, that is also an option.
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Post by 2003LimitedAWD on Jan 10, 2020 23:56:07 GMT -5
Glad to hear that you're not giving up on it and hope the worst case scenario doesn't occur anytime soon. How many miles is on yours? I run my green one hard as well (especially trailer towing), so hope not to get the same eventual result. I use 5W-30 Pennzoil high mileage conventional oil and change every 5k miles. Got 225K on it. So far, runs strong and noise free.
Got to pull the motor in my white 03 at some point to locate an internal noise that I fear is a rod bearing. Have yet to see even one bit of metal shavings though, so not sure what to think. May just pull the oil pan first and see if there's anything obvious.
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Post by Naeos_Valkarian on Jan 11, 2020 1:29:04 GMT -5
Glad to hear that you're not giving up on it and hope the worst case scenario doesn't occur anytime soon. How many miles is on yours? I run my green one hard as well (especially trailer towing), so hope not to get the same eventual result. I use 5W-30 Pennzoil high mileage conventional oil and change every 5k miles. Got 225K on it. So far, runs strong and noise free. Got to pull the motor in my white 03 at some point to locate an internal noise that I fear is a rod bearing. Have yet to see even one bit of metal shavings though, so not sure what to think. May just pull the oil pan first and see if there's anything obvious. It's got 212K on it, still no abnormal noises as of today either and still has plenty of power. Going to do another oil change in a few days just to see what I find and maybe send some off for an oil analysis. Another thing I noticed was a crazy amount of copper glitter everywhere, I even found it in the valve cover gasket grooves. It almost looked like anti-seize. Edit: I'm going to send in a sample to Blackstone Labs in a couple hundred more miles, assuming my engine makes it that far. (I think it will) |
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Post by jkdv8 on Jan 12, 2020 22:01:28 GMT -5
That’s a shame man. Yea have it tested, they could tell you what type of metals are present to determine where it’s coming from.
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Post by Naeos_Valkarian on Jan 13, 2020 1:10:25 GMT -5
That’s a shame man. Yea have it tested, they could tell you what type of metals are present to determine where it’s coming from. At this point I'm actually sure that a slight imbalance in the crank could be the cause of the bearing failure, Ever since I brought my sport into a shop to have them drill the crank snout I've noticed excess vibration from the engine but every mechanic I've had look at it said it's just a slight harmless misfire. I've already priced the component cost and I'm in the process of trying to secure a dry covered concrete square to do the work on, as well as time off work. I'll be installing a reman crank and fitted bearings, new harmonic balancer, timing belt, t-belt tensioner and pullies, water pump, cam seals(front and rear), crank seals(front and rear), new valve stem seals, and 24 brand spankin new lash adjusters just because. I'm not going to be doing new rings and honing the cylinders because of time constraints and the fact that I have no loss in compression as of this time nor am I burning excess oil from driving. If I pull everything apart and see I need new rings then I'll do it but for the time being it's not on the list. I also plan on completely cleaning the engine and bay, painting the block and heads, and installing new plastic wire harness conduit to replace all the dry rotted stuff. My other thought is that I should probably change the torque converter seal on the transmission and a new oil pump. If anyone has any thoughts on any of this I'd be grateful. This is going to be both fun and nerve racking. EDIT: After thinking about this, I may just forgo the lash adjusters in favor of new rings, I can always install new lash adjusters later. |
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Post by 2003LimitedAWD on Jan 14, 2020 22:26:10 GMT -5
Sounds like a solid plan, you've got pretty much everything covered. I agree about the rings; if you got it torn down that far, may as well hone the cylinders and replace the rings. The lash adjusters are damn expensive (cost me $125 for the set of 24). I was redoing the heads on the 3.5 and had to take them all out so the machine shop could clean and check flatness. Almost half of the lash adjusters fell apart in my hand after I removed them, so had to buy the set.
Amazon has the nice OEM Aisen water pumps (WPM-035) for a cheap $78.73.
Another thought is to check is the water pipe that runs under the intake since those tend to rust and leak after awhile.
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Post by Naeos_Valkarian on Jan 14, 2020 23:08:04 GMT -5
Sounds like a solid plan, you've got pretty much everything covered. I agree about the rings; if you got it torn down that far, may as well hone the cylinders and replace the rings. The lash adjusters are damn expensive (cost me $125 for the set of 24). I was redoing the heads on the 3.5 and had to take them all out so the machine shop could clean and check flatness. Almost half of the lash adjusters fell apart in my hand after I removed them, so had to buy the set. Amazon has the nice OEM Aisen water pumps (WPM-035) for a cheap $78.73. Another thought is to check is the water pipe that runs under the intake since those tend to rust and leak after awhile. The major bits of the plan as of now is to do the rings/honing, replace the crankshaft, bearings, and oil pump. I have a nice Aisen water pump already. If I need to cut cost I bet that thing will run for another TBelt interval no problem. As far as that water pipe goes, I'm pretty darn sure it's leaking again but I just don't know from which end. If the coolant is too full it'll dump it into the valley once I turn the engine off which then deposits under the driver side firewall. I'll get everything sorted out when the time comes for sure.  |
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Post by Naeos_Valkarian on Jan 17, 2020 23:15:43 GMT -5
I talked with a mechanic today and he said the copper could possibly be from camshaft bearings? As far as I know, the 6G72 doesn't use cam bearings. When I had the valve covers off week before last I didn't see anything abnormal.
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Post by 2003LimitedAWD on Jan 17, 2020 23:55:34 GMT -5
Right, no cam bearings. Even if there were, it would take some major oil starvation for those to wear that badly. Just can't think of anything it could be aside from crank or rod bearings. I'll be curious to hear the results of the oil analysis.
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Post by Naeos_Valkarian on Jan 18, 2020 0:38:41 GMT -5
Right, no cam bearings. Even if there were, it would take some major oil starvation for those to wear that badly. Just can't think of anything it could be aside from crank or rod bearings. I'll be curious to hear the results of the oil analysis. Just got the kit in the mail today but gotta put a few hundred more miles on this oil change before I send it off. If I can get the time I'll be pulling my oil pan this week to take a look. Supposed to be quite easy to do on the RWD gen 1 sports. |
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Post by Naeos_Valkarian on Feb 3, 2020 0:48:18 GMT -5
Update: Still no signs of rod knock or other abnormal symptoms and it's been 364 miles since the last oil change and I've been driving like I normally do. I haven't had a chance to pull the oil pan just yet but I did some extensive digging for information on the engine restore additive. I read the entire American FAQ page on the manufacturers website and didn't see anything that stood out to me or rather I anything I didn't already know, but then I stumbled across the European version of the FAQ page which has way more information about the product on it. Low and behold, four questions from the bottom states that after the initial application (1 full can) you can run 5% by volume of engine oil which is about 64% of a can or 236ml would be their minimum recommended dosage. I have been using the whole can each time which may be building up in the form of copper sludge as noted by this dodgy picture of one of my valve covers and depositing excess copper into the pan. I am theorizing the irregular metal flakes/shavings I saw may have been from the drain plug. I'm still going to send off the oil for analysis when I drop the pan, provided I can get the time to do it. Here's a closeup of the copper sludge I was talking about, I even found it in the oil filler tube.  And here's a picture of the crazy amount of fine copper I found in the pan.  |
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Post by Naeos_Valkarian on Mar 8, 2020 1:49:10 GMT -5
Update!
I changed my oil again at roughly 1,100 miles since the last oil change and I once again saw copper glitter in the drain pan but not anywhere near the concentration as last time, however considering that the last oil change made it 5K miles the amount could scale. I also took my oil sample and I'm sending it off to Blackstone Labs on Monday with overnight shipping to get the results. I will post back here when I get them.
Also I did not add the engine restorer and lubricant this time to see what will happen.
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Post by Naeos_Valkarian on Mar 18, 2020 19:12:17 GMT -5
Alright guys, I finally got the oil analysis back from the lab. The results are slightly inconclusive but they do mention that the wear they are seeing is consistent with 4000 mile oil change intervals on the 6G72. Do note that the oil sample I sent off was at 1,100 miles, not sure what to make of it though. Without further ado, here's the results: Edit: Also note I am running a cleanable cone filter by spectre, it's due for a cleaning and re-oiling.  |
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I'm guessing that a main bearing (or more) is disintegrating and you'll likely start seeing/hearing symptoms soon. 
